Ed Couchman, head of sales for the UK and Northern Europe at Spotify, joins Ella Sagar to talk about the company's long-term advertising ambition, its podcast and audiobook strategy, Apple's app practices and how kindness should not be seen as a weakness.

He underscores the commitment to CEO Daniel Ek's goal of generating 20% of revenue from advertising and describes a "longer-term aspiration" for Spotify's advertising sales.

Couchman says: "We do want in the long term for the ad sales to reach $10bn – so a real sizeable revenue contribution to the overall business."

Elsewhere, he reveals the streamer's "case-by-case" podcast strategy and how he would hypothetically like to see advertising in audiobooks.

Couchman also expands on his recent column on how kindness at work is never a weakness, pointing out why it "has never been more needed" in the industry.

Highlights:

03:38: Why kindness in media and advertising leadership is a superpower

10:07: Spotify's long-term advertising ambition

12:48: What's next for non-exclusive podcasts?

15.15: Growing the audiobook market

17:16: The audiobook advertising dream

18.28: Spotify's "Time to Play Fair" campaign taking aim at Apple

23.55: Why are you passionate about media?

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This episode was edited by our production partner Trisonic.

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